Great content. I agree that the 124 looks better than the Miata. I don't think there is anything wrong with the Miata's look per se, it just appears a little pinched and squinty. The 124 immediately recalls the classic Fiat Spiders and is a handsome timeless design that will age beautifully.

The engine I struggle with...like almost all new turbo engines. It's Italian, but when I think of the classic Spiders, I think of high-revving dual-cam fours that love to live near redline and make wonderful noises. That's the very Italian approach in my mind. But the same can be said of all mfgs I can think of at this point. Just like Chevy...when people think of classic Chevys it will be small blocks, but today they are more likely to house a turbo four-popper. It's one of the reasons I went with the ND2, an engine like that is an endangered species and a powerful recall of classic roadsters. I hear good things about the 1.4L MultiAir though and they are built like a brick shithouse.

I'm envious of the NC2/3 trans in the 124 MTs. The ND's Achilles heel is the transmission, which after 5 (!!) iterations to solve the problems of them grenading, then had a huge shipment of bad syncros from a supplier that is now grenading transmissions in '22 and '23 (and even a few '24) cars. I have a '22 and it is always back of mind. I consider the trans barely shy of an engineering failure, which is both hard to admit and very, very rare for Mazda. It would have been a huge improvement indeed to have simply kept the NC trans. It doesn't feel quite as slick and refined, but it is a much better trans.

The seats and surfacing of the 124 interior is indeed better than that of the Miata, and more in line with a mini-GT. They are quite nice inside.

Thanks for sharing!

Pic of the classic 124 for reference:

 

The engine I struggle with...like almost all new turbo engines. It's Italian, but when I think of the classic Spiders, I think of high-revving dual-cam fours that love to live near redline and make wonderful noises. That's the very Italian approach in my mind. But the same can be said of all mfgs I can think of at this point. Just like Chevy...when people think of classic Chevys it will be small blocks, but today they are more likely to house a turbo four-popper. It's one of the reasons I went with the ND2, an engine like that is an endangered species and a powerful recall of classic roadsters. I hear good things about the 1.4L MultiAir though and they are built like a brick shithouse.

The engine might be best ahead of an automatic, where the strong torque down low can be put to best advantage. The engine is not a revver, max is 6500 rpm but there's little reason to approach the limit, because there's nothing up there to access as it starts to fall flat after 5500. I usually run it 3000 - 5000 on backroads honks, where I'm in 3rd gear most of the time, with occasional downshifts to second for tight corners and uphifts into 4th when it straightens out a bit. This I do with a relaxed bump forward or back on the auto stick, and couldn't be happier in the process.

I could also mention that the Bose audio system is far and away superior to the 8-speaker GR86/BRZ system, which simply isn't acceptable in any respect.

 

The '84 Pininfarina Spidereuropa Volumex (supercharged) was pretty sweet.

 

@Ritter Nice report, my friend. Very helpful. Thank you.

@BadgerOne I'm with you, buddy. For me, a roadster like this has to have a naturally aspirated twin cam. (As a rule, I don't like forced induction on any street car, but that, as they say, is my problem.) It appears that emissions requirements have all but killed off those great old engines.

@Ritter Would I get all tingly if I went for the Abarth? Why stop at the Lusso if there is more to be had?

@BadgerOne You state, "I hear good things about the 1.4L MultiAir though and they are built like a brick shithouse." I did not know this. One of my concerns with this car is the powertrain — its robustness and reliability. Some brick shithouse-iness would be truly awesome.

 

I'm not familiar with the auto, but if you are looking at the MT, between the construction of the 1.4 and the NC trans, it's about as close to mechanically bulletproof as you can get. The 1.4 is just burly, especially the bottom end. NC trans can hold up to some much stouter power production. Ritter might be able to touch more on reliability.

The ND engines are also zero-concern engines and very durable, not as robust as the 1.4 but I've never seen one killed outside of a money shift. The trans is the wildcard, '19 and '20 seem to be the sweet spot with very few problems reported. Before that, possible issues....'21-current possible issues.

 

I'm honestly surprised the 124 has waited this long to be reviewed on the forum!! Everytime I see a 124 in the wild, I always think of Ritter😂😂😂

 

Here's the 2018 brochure (attached).

 

Throttle House nibbled around the edges of what makes the engine interesting, but I don't know that they completely nailed it. I have a pet peeve of people talking about "turbo lag" as if it is the time it takes for the engine to spool up to where the turbo itself spools up. No, that is called not being on boost, or being in too high a gear. The real meaning of "turbo lag" is when you are on boost, let's say at 50% throttle, and you increase to 75% throttle. There's a measureable lag between when you move the throttle +25% and when the turbo responds with increased boost. With this engine, I would challenge anyone to consistently detect and notice that tiny fraction of time. As soon as you increase throttle, rpm increases, and then almost immediately rpm increases even faster as boost now matches the new throttle setting.

 

Another fun tid bit to know is that the 124 was supposed to be the faster of the two cars. Originally the ND was only supposed to have the 1.5L engine across all markets but very, very, late in development Mazda USA convinced Mazda JPN that the Miata would be a laughing stock in the west with just a 1.5L.

 

That's a good point. ND owners have Fiat to thank for shaming Mazda into offering a larger engine. In fact, even with the ND1 engine, I believe the Fiat was still faster, leading to the ND2 engine.

 

I feel rather validated for not getting a Miata.

 

Nah, see Miata's all the time, I don't see many 124's!

 

The problem with lightness obsession is that there's a time and a place for it. Go too far, you get junk that's barely adequate for the job and always a question even when it appears fine. How about keep the 20 whole pound difference or whatever and supply a transmission that has some damn durability? After all, they're compromised road cars, anyway. And after cutting weight on the transmission at the cost of durability, they choose to go with a power top on the RF? A manual roof panel would be lighter (especially nice up high), cheaper, and less worry while allowing more packaging options because a removable panel wouldn't have to be attached to the raise/lower mechanism.

 

I feel compelled to repeat what I said elsewhere: A friend of mine had a Lotus Elan. He once said, "It was falling apart when it was just parked in the driveway."

 

To add my .2 cents I absolutely adored this car and I would still have it to this day if it wasn’t my daily car. I do about 60 miles round trip and it’s just too small for me. I’m 6’1 and my seat was all the way back and no recline. Plus not much room to haul anything it kinda was a “one seater” for me.
I had the European abarth exhaust on mine and it sounded glorious.
I did have premature turbo failure so I went the route of an upgraded turbo and bigger Intercooler with tune and after that the car was perfect. I did end up doing a Miata retrofit for the apple CarPlay which brought it up to spec with the later iterations of these cars.

But I found a buyer who ended up wanting a perfectly set up car just as mine was and we still keep in contact, which made letting it go hurt less. All in all i drove it for 5 years and only have great memories.

 

I dunno. Since you picked up an auto, either one would have been a great choice. I still don't regret my Miata one bit (it's my second ND after a 2016), in fact I still prefer the driving experience over the BRZ. It's just too damn good and has that little extra sumthin' that makes it more enjoyable than the Subaru. I think it's control feel and feedback more than anything. The BRZ is fun; the Miata is a riot.

 

That’s true. With the AT there’s likely no disadvantage on the Miata side.

I definitely agree on the fun to drive part. Honestly I think a lot of the roads I drive are almost too small and / or twisty for the BRZ. I think it would do better somewhere with wider sweepers that you can run at higher speeds.

 

By the way, for anyone finding this thread and wanting a deep dive into the care & feeding of a 124 Spider, there's an incredible blog called 21st Century Fiat 124 Spider by a guy named "Ameridan", where he collects and archives just about every bit of technical info, tips, tricks, & workarounds that you can imagine.

 

You're making me want one! It sounds like it out handles the GR/BRZ on tight roads and is more fun to chuck around. Acceleration must be similar given the lower weight.

 

Well, if you want something REALLY fun to chuck around on super-tight roads....

 

I saw a cappuccino a few years ago. Its even smaller in person. I'd rock one. I'm still trying to replace sport bikes with cars since I quit riding.

 

Interesting visual comparison of the early Miata ND MT vs. the Fiat 124 ("NF") MT, which is essentially the NC gearbox with a different bellhousing to fit the Fiat 1.4L. One of these looks beefier than the other!