Toyota 86 or Subaru BRZ
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I'd really like it if someone in one of these styling departments knew how to draw an actual good looking front end. The ND Miata actually looks good, but the BR-Z is odd and the Nissan and GR86 are undistinguished.
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So far the BRZ does look like a better looking car. But for reasons unknown Toyota hasn't bothered with promoting the GR86 at all. It will be interesting to see if the styling differences justify the price difference.
The second coming no longer exists. The affordable sports car is a dying breed. Most are really hot hatches or sedans.
The true RWD sports cars that are semi affordable are really down to 3. The Miata, the 86, and the BRZ. The Mustang and Camaro are too large to really be considered sports cars. They are muscle cars that have greatly improved handling. I might say that the Camaro when properly equipped can bridge the gap between muscle car and sports car. But the small, light, agile RWD sportscar that are affordable are the three I mention above. To get the same kind of enjoyment connection you have to spend a lot more money. The 400Z even in its lowest spec has to start over 40K. That not an affordable sports car. Further being developed from the 370Z suggests an uphill clime to achieve that light agile handling.
Not saying Nissan cannot greatly improve this chassis. However they are dealing with a heavy engine saddled now with a turbo. A trans axle might improve the weight distribution. It will be interesting to see what Nissan does with this issue.
The true RWD sports cars that are semi affordable are really down to 3. The Miata, the 86, and the BRZ. The Mustang and Camaro are too large to really be considered sports cars. They are muscle cars that have greatly improved handling. I might say that the Camaro when properly equipped can bridge the gap between muscle car and sports car. But the small, light, agile RWD sportscar that are affordable are the three I mention above. To get the same kind of enjoyment connection you have to spend a lot more money. The 400Z even in its lowest spec has to start over 40K. That not an affordable sports car. Further being developed from the 370Z suggests an uphill clime to achieve that light agile handling.
Not saying Nissan cannot greatly improve this chassis. However they are dealing with a heavy engine saddled now with a turbo. A trans axle might improve the weight distribution. It will be interesting to see what Nissan does with this issue.
There is no such thing as overpowered.
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As a stand alone, no. But unless a car is quite expensive, high power also means high weight, which kills the attributes a sports car needs to be playful on a curvy road. And "quite expensive" is well past the BRZ/GR86 range. Even Corvettes and Porsches are losing some of their playfulness because they are getting too damn heavy.
Power is only part of it.
Cars are getting heavier because they have to strengthen the structure to withstand the crash tests. It is getting heavier because of the multiple amenities that the consumers want.
Cars are getting more expensive because of the above plus adjustment to the inflation coming from the workers’ salaries.
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I'll give the "yes, but" here. The new 86 is gaining something like 20 pounds and may cost about the same - but with a bit more power. Mazda even managed to pare close to 200 pounds off the NC Miata for the ND. Yes, they made it smaller, but the current version doesn't weigh more than the NA of 30 years ago. Not gaining weight is more about the manufacturer caring about weight and not overloading a car with "luxury" baubles that add weight.
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100 Posts
The BRZ for me right now.
But I've had a lot more time seeing that cars real pictures in the metal. And originally it took me a while to like the BRZ, because mentally I couldn't get the old car out of my head - and now I love it.
And neither of them in the flesh of course. So I certainly think that when I actually see proper metal pictures of the toyota it might change, and in particular I'm not happy with the WRC Blue being the special color, so I'm keen on seeing what signature color Toyota will go with (so long as its not burnt orange again). I'm hoping for a light blue/green/silver pearlescent based color that shows all the new body lines.
I've already got a deposit on the Toyota, I might put one down on the Subaru (if they let me) and just pick my favorite when they release.
But I've had a lot more time seeing that cars real pictures in the metal. And originally it took me a while to like the BRZ, because mentally I couldn't get the old car out of my head - and now I love it.
And neither of them in the flesh of course. So I certainly think that when I actually see proper metal pictures of the toyota it might change, and in particular I'm not happy with the WRC Blue being the special color, so I'm keen on seeing what signature color Toyota will go with (so long as its not burnt orange again). I'm hoping for a light blue/green/silver pearlescent based color that shows all the new body lines.
I've already got a deposit on the Toyota, I might put one down on the Subaru (if they let me) and just pick my favorite when they release.
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I hope Toyota kicks off the 2nd-gen 86 with something like the Hakone Edition of the 1st-gen but toned down a bit. I would love to see the new 86 to have a signature color of either green or blue, something that will be limited to it. I also hope it be more differentiated than the BRZ. Patiently waiting till the unveil soon...
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There are always special editions when the car debuts - they don't tend to re-use the same stuff unless its a heritage color (like the WRC Blue).
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I'm going with the BRZ, mainly because I'm bit of a Subaru fanboy. But after seeing the patent leak it kind of sealed the deal. I think both will look good, but I do like the BRZ looks more, and maybe that just part of my bias, idk.
Though I like the WRC Blue, and it fits the car surprisingly well, I too was hoping for bit of a different signature debut color. I'm still undecided what color I like the most, in the end it might come down to what I can get my hands on first.
Though I like the WRC Blue, and it fits the car surprisingly well, I too was hoping for bit of a different signature debut color. I'm still undecided what color I like the most, in the end it might come down to what I can get my hands on first.
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As a Subaru fan what do you think of the engine change to the 2.4L boxer?
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I think its what the original twins deserved. A set of headers and tune get the 1st Gen to basically the same hp. So I bet the same on this will be perfect, maybe ~250-260 with headers and a tune.
It's cool to think a 2.5l ej25 made 165hp and 166lb-ft and now the 2.4l fa24 makes 228hp and 184lb-ft.
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Welcome to the forum @SockMonkey
Being a Subaru fanboy, any things you have on your wishlist for when the 2022 BRZ configurator finally becomes available?
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Thank you!
Not that I can think of specially, more overall. Coming from a 13 BRZ I think most things will be a big upgrade, specially interior wise. The '13 head unit was abysmal to interact with and the sound wasn't the best either. Steering wheel controls will be nice as well. Obviously the additional power and torque will be nice as well.
I'd like the performance package, mostly for cosmetics, because I like the look of the brembos. But it doesn't look like that will be offered at first. So I'll probably do a brake swap and a minor lower, maybe 0.75-1"
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The added horsepower and more importantly torque is going to besuch a great feeling in these new cars.
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Even with all the changes, do you still see areas that performance can be improved?
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I think for a fun daily driver it's hard to improve, maybe building more adjustability into the stock suspension like a miata. But beyond that it'll be nit picking little things at that point, and I probably won't know until I have it. Like the last Gen I don't expect intakes to have any gains, probably headers, 93 pump and a tune will pretty much maximize its NA potential. But being a brand new car I don't think I'll mess with that stuff at first anyway, incase there are warranty issues. Even the brembos are likely overkill, but I love the looks of them, so I'll probably do it just for the looks.
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Brembos are pretty nice to have, my cousin has them on his Mini JCW and it's hilarious how big they are in the front.
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