[jkim85]

2021 Subaru BRZ’s engine heard for first time in new video | Autocar

252bhp sports car will be a US-only model, however, with “no plans” for European launch

www.autocar.co.uk

A spokesperson told Autocar that the coupé will be a US-only model and that there are "no plans" to launch it in Europe, as is the case with Nissan's similarly positioned new 400Z.

 

[pngrant54]

That could be the key to the engine offering in the BRZ/86. A smaller turbo engine would seem to be a more logical choice to meet emissions and fuel economy for Europe. So if the car is not going to be offered in Europe it may mean the N/A 2.4 with 217 HP and 177 LBS of torque is what is on offer for this car after all.

 

[jkim85]

That could be the key to the engine offering in the BRZ/86. A smaller turbo engine would seem to be a more logical choice to meet emissions and fuel economy for Europe. So if the car is not going to be offered in Europe it may mean the N/A 2.4 with 217 HP and 177 LBS of torque is what is on offer for this car after all.

I think you are correct. The fact that the car won't be sold in Europe means we are more likely to see an NA motor.

 

[Haskins]

I guess that means the GR86 won't be sold in Europe either? It's been interesting seeing Subaru get ahead of this while Toyota hasn't been doing much.

 

[apex]

I guess that means the GR86 won't be sold in Europe either? It's been interesting seeing Subaru get ahead of this while Toyota hasn't been doing much.

It sure seems like the 86 could be limited as well:

"Though the article doesn't say why the BRZ won't be available in Europe, the Toyota 86 and Supra's chief engineer Tetsuya Tada may have given a clue. In a 2019 interview at the Supra's U.S. launch, he revealed that one reason he partnered with BMW was because he wanted the Supra to be a truly global sports car. Given the rapid tightening of safety and emissions regulations in various markets around the world, if Toyota were to have built its own engines and platforms from scratch, development would have taken too long."

 

[pngrant54]

Yes but the question really is on Subaru, not Toyota. The original 86/BRZ was also considered a global sports car. The difference is BMW is committed to a global engine where apparently Subaru is not at least in the BRZ/86. No part of this could be what BMW charges for their cars and the mark up is enough that they could afford to make a case for the R & D for upgrading their engines to meet global emissions requirements. Subaru perhaps due to the constraints of the original
platform and limited sales as well as limited profit per unit could not make the case to either develop a specific engine for the BRZ nor adapt their current transverse engines in the FWD based AWD products to the RWD platform of the BRZ/86. The current 2.0 is probably at its acceptable limit for an N/A engine in terms of power and torque to meet the longevity requirements. If the engine compartment is not sufficiently different in terms of size again that rules out the turbo
without significant engineering cost. I still believe the N/A engine is the only alternative in flat four configuration. Getting more power requires more displacement. More displacement probably requires more R & D to meet the Euro requirements hence more cost. More R & D means an increased price to the consumer. If they are to stay in the rough price perimeters of the current car they have to pick their battles on cost and where it is sold.

 

[ae86ron]

Yes but the question really is on Subaru, not Toyota. The original 86/BRZ was also considered a global sports car. The difference is BMW is committed to a global engine where apparently Subaru is not at least in the BRZ/86. No part of this could be what BMW charges for their cars and the mark up is enough that they could afford to make a case for the R & D for upgrading their engines to meet global emissions requirements. Subaru perhaps due to the constraints of the original
platform and limited sales as well as limited profit per unit could not make the case to either develop a specific engine for the BRZ nor adapt their current transverse engines in the FWD based AWD products to the RWD platform of the BRZ/86. The current 2.0 is probably at its acceptable limit for an N/A engine in terms of power and torque to meet the longevity requirements. If the engine compartment is not sufficiently different in terms of size again that rules out the turbo
without significant engineering cost. I still believe the N/A engine is the only alternative in flat four configuration. Getting more power requires more displacement. More displacement probably requires more R & D to meet the Euro requirements hence more cost. More R & D means an increased price to the consumer. If they are to stay in the rough price perimeters of the current car they have to pick their battles on cost and where it is sold.

I’m thinking if could it be the Subaru BRZ will only be sold in the US and the Toyota 86 in the US and other parts of the world?

If the Subaru BRZ isn’t going to be sold in Europe, why not Subaru/Toyota develop an all-electric version as an option? For sure enthusiasts of the RWD coupé in Europe will be disappointed. Sound like government in the Europe is in full force to replace all their cars to electric. Not sure if it’s a good idea.

That’s also one of my concerns now. Say if I buy a BRZ/86 now and then an all-electric version will be launched soon, I believe the electric version would be a more practical choice for long term. Can’t avoid thinking about it since a lot of automakers are really pushing for electrification.

 

[pngrant54]

In my opinion at the present time it would not seem so likely to be in the cards. The original BRZ/86 was not exactly a sales success. This replacement needs to be in the market place for a while and see if sales improve based on the improvements we assume are in this version 2. If it did not sell all that well in Europe its hard to see why Subaru/Toyota would spend the money on engineering an EV version. EV's make the most sense in family cars, SUV's and CUV's at the moment. While there are exceptions Fiat 500 etc. Its tough get a battery small enough to fit and still offer 200 plus mileage range. Larger vehicles allow larger batteries. I think Europe is going more EV primarily due to VW and PSA. VW, made a 180 degree turn away from diesel after the scandal. I would guess an EV version(if at all) would come a long time down the road after significant sales in their more mainstream cars.

 

[supra_1993]

The GR86 will be.

Toyota GR86 will arrive in Europe and other markets after all? - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB

Toyota GR86 will arrive in Europe and other markets after all? GR86 General Topics (2nd Gen 2022+ Toyota 86)

www.ft86club.com

 

[ae86ron]

The GR86 will be.

Toyota GR86 will arrive in Europe and other markets after all? - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB

Toyota GR86 will arrive in Europe and other markets after all? GR86 General Topics (2nd Gen 2022+ Toyota 86)

www.ft86club.com

Possibly more of marketing strategy. Sell the BRZ in US only and the GR86 worldwide.

 

[pngrant54]

The question is will they use the same engine to be sold in the US or will they use, for example, the new 1.8 turbo from the Levorg? I've seen on this site mention of the GR86 being sold in Spain but the BRZ being sold in Australia. Of course when the original car came out it was sold as the 86/BRZ in Europe, the BRZ Scion FRS originally in the States. So Subaru saying the BRZ will not be sold in Europe may be a correct statement. But this says nothing about the 86. Being that Toyota may be more of a worldwide company it is easily conceivable that it would be sold in other markets. Further it is conceivable that they could use a different engine for other markets for emissions compliance.
Who knows maybe because they are calling the Toyota version the "GR" 86 they perhaps could fit the new 1.6 turbo from the new Toyota Yaris into the engine bay. As of now we have no idea if the engine bay is the same size or large enough to fit an inline four cylinder. The profile of the car seems to indicate a higher but longer roof line that slopes down at the front. So perhaps maybe there is room for an inline four cylinder turbo. I've seen a few video reviews of the new GR Yaris and they have been positive. That would be quite interesting but I guess that would not be offered in the states. I assume I am wrong as the engine bay size has probably not changed much as it is on the current BRZ/86 platform.I'm assuming that the 1.8 turbo from the Levorg is a physically smaller engine than the 2.4 engine from the Subaru Accent. If that is the case there may be enough room for the turbo 1.8 to fit. Of course this my mere speculation. I will say that so far Subaru/Toyota have done a good job keeping us in the dark.....

 

[supra_1993]

Possibly more of marketing strategy. Sell the BRZ in US only and the GR86 worldwide.

The 86 will be sold in the U.S. The leaked dealer road map said so...